Napoleon Series Archive 2013

Re: Bernadotte's Leadership Failure

Kevin:

I did bring both Vachee and Maude up. I just don't have some of the pages you seem to.
I have found that the "why" is more readily answered when the How, Who, Where, When and What are answered, because they are what lead the participants to why they act. Which means that "why?" may be the most interesting question, but sussing out and understanding the why is very dependent on the other "W's."

And if I have misinterpreted your posts as attempting to assess blame, then I am glad you have corrected my impression. I will say when you use words like blame, exonerate, fault, kindness, abandoned, and the other trigger words you have sprinkled throughout your posts, that is what led me to that conclusion. [I am more than glad to catelogue them if that would help to see what I am talkng about.]

Finally, I am also looking at the situation as a soldier and/or a commander might. And the evidence does point to Bernadotte abandoning Davout-ignoring the battle to his rear as he marched to Dornburg, 'firmly silencing' Sahuc when he wanted to countermarch his division to Davout's assistance, the slowness of Bernadotte's march first to Dornburg and then Apolda, and his failure to engage the enemy while he marched between two battles.

I don't see that 'abandoning Davout' issue being raised by anyone in command. If a division commander suggested spliting my command, countermarching back across my line of march, depending on where in the march column that division was located, [particularly if it was cavalry] onstensibly a difficult march, to

maybe
reach Davout in time, I might 'firmly silence' the officer, particularly when he hadn't been in command of that division very long. If Bernadotte was frustrated with the march, knowing he wasn't getting to where he was supposed to be, he might be a little testy when a subordinate suggests be given an independent command, the clear implication being that the officer thinks Bernadotte's current efforts are wrong. I would think that would also be the thinking of a soldier and a commander.

Who says Bernadotte 'abandoned' Davout? Was that an expectation, or the judgment of some historian a hundred years later? And I'm not talking about line foot soldiers or those who disliked Bernadotte anyway. Did Davout say Bernadotte abandoned him? Napoleon? Any of their senior officers? I see a definite expectation of what he *should* have done on your part, but I don't see it in the words of the participants. Napoleon contemplated courtmartialling Bernadotte. It wasn't for "abandoning" Davout.

I can point out a number of instances during the Jena campaign where the French were 'in contact' with the enemy, including heavy skirmishes, some leading to Saalfeld and other early engagements. However, I don't see that 'abandonment' issue ever coming up as different corps carried out their orders in the face of the enemy.

It is like Vachee saying that the vague orders 'profited' Bernadotte. He gives a 'why' without every explaining the When, How, Who, Where and What that would substantiate what the heck that mean, other than unsubstantiate Innuendo?

Let's get away of conclusion statements like 'abandonment' when the When, How, Where, When and Who have not been established from what I can see.

Who says Bernadotte abandon Davout?--the commanders on the ground
Where would he have been if he hadn't 'abandoned' Davout vis-a-vis the enemy and the road to Dornburg his troops were already marching on?
When did Davout know what the contact meant? What was his conclusions about his need for support, as he had the largest corps in the army?
Who made the decision? Did Davout suggest anything else. I find it interesting how prominent that statement is about Davout asking Bernadotte 'regarding' his decision.
How was Bernadotte to interpret his orders, orders he had on the 12th to Support Murat, who he knew was in Dornburg, and now had Davout's order that said he was expected there by the Emperor.

I also am not sure how Davout had Prussians behind him. He was moving south and west towards Auerstadt. He went to meet the Prussians. He didn't wait for them to come to him. Why? Because he believed they were moving west and north, away from him. A pursuit, rather than some threat where Bernadotte was abandoning him to the Prussian Main army. That was supposedly around Jena where Bernadotte was ordered to go, where Murat was. I am trying to see how Davout was abandoned. Each commander had their orders.

Best Regards, Bill

Messages In This Thread

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Belliard gives us more information
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Historical Conclusions...
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pourriez